Philosophy God and Evil

So, by your perspective, in order to attain true perfection for everyone our free will would have to be compromised? That mankind would have to have one point of view, one set of opinions, otherwise we could never be truly happy?

 

Not to put words in the great MT's mouth, but that is what it is sounding like to me. Though of course, you make it sound so vicious and malicious and venomous, but really that is what would probably have to be attained to attain true prefection, or a utopian-esque idea. With free will there will always be a difference of opinion which can guarantee conflict which completely nullifies the idea and point of perfection.

At least, that's taken from, as what MT would probably refer to as, my idea of perfection. A utopian-esque and unattainable goal.

 

I just want to point out that, even if there is a difference of opinion, that doesn't nesassarily mean that there has to be conflict. If paradise is ever attained, I would like to think that people ARE allowed their own thoughts, and are encouraged to debate and revise those thought. That isn't negativity. It's progress.

 

Even further proving the point that there are differences in the ideas of perfection and negativity thus making a state of Utopia even more unobtainable. Thank you for proving my point for me.

 

Just because there are differences in the ideas does NOT mean there is conflict. For example, if you argue your point of view in an intelligent way, there is a chance that MY perspective will change. No one person can see everything. Those who accept this and adapt with the flow of progress I believe will be the ones to attain paradise (if such a place is to exist).

 

I've been wanting to respond to this thread for awhile, but I honestly haven't had the time or the dilligence to do it (hey, it is summer!) So anyhow, here goes nothing...

Well I truthfully don't believe in any sort of god, but if I'm totally off base here and one does exist, then I suspect he allows evil in this world to bring out the good in people. If we existed in an all around perfect world, it'd probably be almost more imperfect then the world we live in now. Sure, in essence all of our troubles and problems would be obsolete, but nobody could ever experience true happiness. As once said in some old book that I forgot the title of, "Happiness can't exist without accompanying sorrow". If we all lived in a world absent of evil, wouldn't things be slightly...I dunno.. dull? If we didnt need to overcome any obstacles in order to further our characters, we'd never have the opportunity to develop and grow to our full potential. This may be a strange analogy, but for some reason I'm thinking of some of the animals in zoos. Sure, in the zoos they're well fed and sheltered without any survival problems, but do you honestly think that's where they want to be? Some of them, yes, but some of them might prefer the wildlife where, although things might be slightly more difficult and dangerous, they'll finally reach the freedom they deserve.

Also, there are quite a few positive emotions that result from evil. Relief, for instance. Haven't you ever been incredibly worried about something, only to find out later that your reasoning was way off base and whatever it was that ailed you can now stroll happily out of your brain? Didn't that create a warm, relieved sensation within you? And then there's fear...if it weren't for evil, we'd probably have no need to feel fear. Without fear there'd be no obstacles to overcome, and that brings me back to my original point that happiness follows sorrow.

Of course, there's also, as Neph pointed out, the theory that God may have absolutely no control over evil and therefore cannot prevent it's reign.

 

con·flict ( P ) Pronunciation Key (knflkt)
n.
A state of open, often prolonged fighting; a battle or war.
A state of disharmony between incompatible or antithetical persons, ideas, or interests; a clash.
Psychology. A psychic struggle, often unconscious, resulting from the opposition or simultaneous functioning of mutually exclusive impulses, desires, or tendencies.
Opposition between characters or forces in a work of drama or fiction, especially opposition that motivates or shapes the action of the plot.

Sounds like a conflict to me.

But, then again, that's not what I'm speaking of. I'm speaking more of the fact that you proved that it's not possible to obtain a true perfection considering there are so many ideas of perfection (which you proved), thus there is no "one perfection" and the idea of reaching everyone's perfection is so utopian it's an absurdity.

utopian

\U*to"pi*an\, a. Of or pertaining to Utopia; resembling Utopia; hence, ideal; chimerical; fanciful; founded upon, or involving, imaginary perfections; as, Utopian projects; Utopian happiness.

Though this is where the Utopia thread I started would come into play and this might be around where Nephilim will jump in and reiterate his input within the Utopian thread claiming a Utopia in that sense is possible through chemical and brain-washing methods and such.

 

Wow. This's starting to get really off-topic! ^_^ Hmm. . . we were origionally talking about God and Evil, right? So, by Amon's perspective, there will be no "Heaven" or "Hell," because what would be horrible or perfect for some wouldn't aply to all? Of course, some would call Earth hell . . .

Just as a point of intrest, my religion believes that Earth is a testing place, and that those who love God and endure Satan will reach Heaven, and that during the "last days" Satan will be cast out forever. So, according to that, God does have evil under control.

 

Just to slip it on, following the theory of Hobbes, one cannot have order and liberty (and thus happiness from the balance) without sacrificing the absolute power (your freedom to do anything you want) for a social contract (governments, rules, and such)

 

Evil is an entirely manmade concept. The things and actions we decribe as evil are things we can't explain or are afraid to. That which we call evil is a reflection of the darker side of our psyche. I believe all have the potential for great destruction, but also great construction. God is, to me, the one who created us, and by allowing us to have a balance of dark and light within, he gave us the choice to choose our own paths, free will. So if you think about it what would we be without it? If God were to destroy evil he would have to destroy all of humanity as well.

 

balance

there has to be a balance there can't be any good if there isn't any evil. like that light need the darkness or like the sun needs the moon i just has to be a balance because if there wasn't then this world be in alot of trouble

 

Evil exists because god gave people a freedom of choice. People have a choice to be good or to be evil. But theres no pure good person and no pure evil person, most people have a bit of evil in them :anime: