Recreation Id Like to Buy an Argument!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by KaMeKaZi, Jul 23, 2002.

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  1. Vash

    Vash New Member

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    Wait a minute!!! What about circumcision and four-wheel drives!?

    Euthanasia....definitely yes, but I don't see why it should really be a doctor's job to do it. I'm more for assisted suicide. And I think people who are against it just haven't experienced enough suffering. Last thing I knew of Elizabeth Kubler-Ross she'd had a major rethink on her anti-euthanasia stance as a result of her own suffering.
     
    #21
    Vash, Jul 24, 2002
  2. Energizer Bunny

    Energizer Bunny i wuv you

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    yeah were all in favor of abortion...*looks at her own post* oh wait does the bunnys post not count in this??not that im looking down on anyone its just that i am prolife (although im a bit confused with the rape thing) and shall not have my idea on the subject tossed aside...not that i enjoy bickering about it im just saying my opinion matters...do you kinda see what im saying??:dizzy2:
     
    #22
    Energizer Bunny, Jul 24, 2002
  3. Vash

    Vash New Member

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    I'm sure it was just an oversight EB.

    I'm not totally comfortable with the title of 'pro-life' myself since some 'pro-lifers' have an ironic tendency to murder fully developed human beings in cold blood. Not in Oz, that I know of, but definitely in the US.
     
    #23
    Vash, Jul 24, 2002
  4. Energizer Bunny

    Energizer Bunny i wuv you

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    hey now!! just bc some 'prolifers' *does the little quote thing with hands* are murderers or what not doesnt mean all of them are!! i know i certainly havent killed anyone recently and could not even begin to think of myself as doing that...*chills* plus i get a little queezy at the sight of blood so i dunno if i could handle it...^.^
     
    #24
    Energizer Bunny, Jul 24, 2002
  5. Vash

    Vash New Member

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    Eep!

    Sorry EB, I never took you for a gun-toting maniac, it was just a general comment on the ugly shape that the movement can sometimes take!
    My feelings on the subject, apart from being shaped by my work, changed forever when I had a dream that my sister was pregnant (which she never has been, to the best of my knowledge) and wasn't sure if she wanted the baby and in the dream I realised that I wanted whatever was best for her, because I loved her and that the potential baby came a poor second to that.
     
    #25
    Vash, Jul 24, 2002
  6. *Fabee*

    *Fabee* Retired

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    Sorry, EB. When I opened the thread and saw my name, I just started reading Vash's post. ;_; Im so sorry!!
     
    #26
    *Fabee*, Jul 24, 2002
  7. Bloodberry

    Bloodberry Bloody Berry
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    i agree with bunny on the one point...i mean it's your choice, but well, easiest way to not have to be faced with the decision is to either not have sex till marrage...or to be as safe as you can if you must...and well, nothing is scarier than the thought that you might be...and are very sure you were careful...that everything is checked over...crap still happens....and well, sometimes abstinance is a hard thing for someppl to do...i don't see myself ever having an abortion, but a friend of mine had one last year...and well, she didn't want ppl telling her it was evil...she had a hard enough time of it knowing she would have been disowned by her parents and kicked out...all she wanted was ppl to help her thro it...and she asked alot of ppl...one almost had her conviced to keep it...but in the end, she had the abortion...she would have had no place to stay, no real way of supporting the child...abortion wasn't the first option she thought of, but the situation came down to being able to both survive...i'm not sure if she did the right thing, but for that point in her life, it was the right thing...and well...i guess it's kinda offensive when guys go off about how bad abortion is...when they become pregnant and have a kid or 2, or can have the ability to, i think then they have the right to say it's bad...or to say what a woman can or can't do...it's totally a girl thing...(gawd...that sounds dumb! lol)
     
    #27
    Bloodberry, Jul 24, 2002
  8. KaMeKaZi

    KaMeKaZi Insanity$%#

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    How is this Anti Scocial for one??? is it practical.. maybe not but you know these RICH ppl they must have something that says Look AT ME.. I Rich.. HA HA...

    Now I grew up in a family that had a Big 4 Wheel Drive Bronco, 4WD Blazer, 4WD Eplorer, a Few 4WD Jeep Grand Loratoes. some tucks... But that not because we were rich.. It was because my Dad worked with this mining company.. Some of yo may have heard of them.. ICI or CIL. Like the paint.. same comp.. Anyway we alway had a company Truck/SUV.. and it was alway 4WD we lived in the city and in town.. But is is ANTI SCOCIAL.. HOW the hell is it Anti SCOCIAL.. (im hoping my caps will make me look like a mad berserker or something).

    anyway this topic is rather silly..

    KAME
     
    #28
    KaMeKaZi, Jul 24, 2002
  9. Bloodberry

    Bloodberry Bloody Berry
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    or do you mean those dumb ****s that have one and then put overly large wheels on it cause it looks "good and cool"? cause then that isn't anti social...that's just stupid...and i hate the ppl that drive trucks and suv's up here already..."ooo i'm a farmer, so i can drive in the middle of the road, swerving like a drunkard and tailgate you in the @$$, pass you, then slow to 25mpph cause i'm a farmer. heh huh..." grrrrrrrrr
     
    #29
    Bloodberry, Jul 24, 2002
  10. Odango_rose

    Odango_rose New Member

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    Well I don't think I'll get into this subject right now, cause I don't know anything about it. It's funny we went from Abortion(I'm undecided) to 4 wheel drives! That was kool lol.
     
    #30
    Odango_rose, Jul 24, 2002
  11. Vash

    Vash New Member

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    I'm soooo glad you asked!

    KaMe....where do I start? I should make it clear to begin with that I have no problem at all with the use of 4WDs by farmers, or others who have a legitimate need for the bloody things. But as you've pointed out most people get them to show off how much money they can afford to waste. So why is this worse than any other piece of conspicuous consumption?

    1)The amount of fuel they waste compared to a family car with the same people carrying capacity. Really hard to justify anything that wastes limited fossil fuels and adds to greenhouse gas emissions, ne?
    2)The needless danger to pedestrians, other cars, anything that gets in their way. They are harder and heavier than is reasonable. When I was 13 I saw a 6-year old run over by a lightweight van. The kid (like the driver) was hysterical, but apart from a couple of grazes and bruises he was OK. If the van had been a Land Cruiser instead he would have been dead, or at least crippled. The front of the van absorbed most of the impact and was badly crumpled. No matter how selfish a person is I would hope that if they really thought about it they would rather pay for car repairs than kill a child. Sadly many people select these type of vehicles to protect their own families, apparently not giving a rat's about other people's.
    3)It put's the owner's own children in far greater danger of being killed by being squashed in their own driveway by a reversing parent, due to reduced visibility behind the vehicle.
    4)They reduce visibility on the road for other drivers. It's like being stuck behind a truck.
    5)Because they don't absorb impact as well, they are more dangerous to the driver in a collision with another hard object, like a tree. Of course if the collision is with another vehicle that is designed to absorb impact the 4WDriver is laughing.

    Will that do for the moment?

    C'mon, who wants some?!
     
    #31
    Vash, Jul 25, 2002
  12. Energizer Bunny

    Energizer Bunny i wuv you

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    wow vash i never thought about all that...and i agree on 1(my friend drives one and always complains about the horrible gas mileage it has) and 4(i drive a little mazda and when they come behind me i cant see anything but a front bumper...quite annoying...) as for the others they might be a little extreme but hey thats just my take on it *shrugs*
     
    #32
    Energizer Bunny, Jul 25, 2002
  13. GenericHero5

    GenericHero5 All Ska Super Star

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    What is this? Everyone drives but Chris now?
    Dang im pished now...

    But i agree, 4WD vehicles in unnecesarry places like suburbs are idiotic and..well...unnecesary!
    My moms friend drives one and she cant stop the dang thing! She almost hit me!!!!!!!
     
    #33
    GenericHero5, Jul 26, 2002
  14. Izzy

    Izzy moo. moo. moo!
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    It's been speculated already that 4WD cars should be driven with the same rules as a semi-truck. That is, on freeways and highways they can only use the two right-most lanes (considering a 4 lane road). And it's pretty true, they have a big lack of visibility, and are a danger to everyone *outside* the truck. In actuality though, some cars also represent the same problems, especially for those people who "want to show off their money". But, of course, the problems involved are more apparent in SUV's and such.

    New technology is also being used to try and make trucks like that safer. Digital real-time cameras on the bumper in conjunction with a rear-view mirror is being introduced (I believe it's starting on the Infiniti Q45, even though it's a car...it has to start somewhere!). Brakes are starting to be developed (although it will *still* take a long while to be domestic market ready, as it is only available for exoticas) from composites to eliminate brake fade and drastically cut down on stopping distance. The new Ford Excursion has a system that allows all FOUR tires to turn simultaneously to make a U-Turn radius only about 10 feet larger than my civic. Again, this is for cars, but the gas mileage problem is not really a problem coming down the road in the future. Mercedes already has an engine that's a v12 that has 28 miles per gallon! That's...incredible. And putting those on SUV's, although not exactly cost-effective for parts and chips for now, will revolutionize the market...along with all the other advances car companies are trying to make to make SUV's safer.

    All in all, the stricter rules are made for cars (although I hate to admit it, being a car buff that loves no limitations) and the more technology available by the likes of Porsche, Ford/GMC, Mercedes, and such...SUV's will get safer. It just takes time, and a lot of effot. But as for now, I agree with all of you, coming from an SUV family...they're pretty dangerous, and the people driving them should have to know what they're doing before buying one. A driving class perhaps? Sorry, but I used to be into SUV's myself, and I see them for what they can be...really useful vehicles meant to WORK, not just to look good...although, that can be really nice too....

    Oh, if you have any point against this, please ignore the paragraphs I have just written. I'm writing this in an argumentative mood, and I *suck* at arguments ;)
     
    #34
    Izzy, Jul 26, 2002
  15. Vash

    Vash New Member

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    I know #2 and #3 sound extreme EB but I don't just have personal experience to back it up with, the stats support me. Statistically, people who own 4WDs have more chance of squishing their own tots. And pedestrians hit by the buggers have much worse injuries.
    And ironically a lot of people don't buy them to show off their wealth, they buy them because they think they're safer!
     
    #35
    Vash, Jul 26, 2002
  16. Bloodberry

    Bloodberry Bloody Berry
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    4wd? umm..not a big car person so i don't know what that means...i assume it's in the same area as the suv and such...and yes, i think you should be forced to take a class to drive suvs and trucks...especially if you grew up on a farm...god..those are the worst...i live in a farming state,,,nothing like coming up on a truck that's driving in the middle of the interstate(only 2 lanes) and weaving around like a drunkard...doind about 30 in a 60....or trying to do mach 40 up your a$$...i'm just glad my little le mans has some good bakes on it/...and well, once i'm going, some good boosting power...not much tho...i mean, it was built be daewoo....(insert random cursing here)
     
    #36
    Bloodberry, Jul 26, 2002
  17. Izzy

    Izzy moo. moo. moo!
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    Sorry Bloodberry, and you're right. Honored readers, whenever I mentioned 4WD "cars" in my rant, I meant that in terms of big and hulking and with the tune of "CANONEROOOOOOOOO!!! HIYA!" churning in the background.

    4WD cars, as in little cars, are a matter all too different. THOSE are really fun to drive!
     
    #37
    Izzy, Jul 26, 2002
  18. Energizer Bunny

    Energizer Bunny i wuv you

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    well youve got me thinking now vash...scary lol i do see how that could happen...poor kids...and the wealth thing i really cant agree with either bc if someone wanted to show off their wealth theyd just get like a mercedes or some other big special fancy expensive car that really isnt much different from some other car... my experience is that they buy them for, as weve said, safety and just bc they like the look of them...
     
    #38
    Energizer Bunny, Jul 27, 2002
  19. Bloodberry

    Bloodberry Bloody Berry
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    and well, they're middle age soccer moms...thinking they're cool shoving their kids into every activity they find thinking it'll keep em out of trouble and make em spend "quality time" with the mom...
     
    #39
    Bloodberry, Jul 27, 2002
  20. KaMeKaZi

    KaMeKaZi Insanity$%#

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    Re: I'm soooo glad you asked!

    The Day i chose to be in a car when crashing into something rather the being in a truck is the day I kick myself in the nuts..

    Car absorb impacts to well.. in fact all they are is a tin can!.. I seen a car wraped around the axel of a transport truck once.. I mean in the city trucks and SUVs are prety pointless but on the highway. they are the best things going today. Car's today Suck anyway. Ive been in a newer car and crashed into the back of a van.. the car was wasted.. the Van just needed a new bumper..

    KaMe
     
    #40
    KaMeKaZi, Jul 28, 2002
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