Yes, those ideas existed before him, but he got the word out. Throughout history oftentimes the one who came up with the concept isn't the one who made it common knowledge. Revelation is what I consider one of the most unrelieable sections of the Bible. I don't know what in the world John was doing at the time he wrote it.
...What?! Have you taken a look at all at any of the other religions Christiany destroyed or subjugated and assimilated? Jesus didn't get the word out at all, especially with the way the Church acted. Edit: Also, Hinduism, Taoism and Buddhism all have, essentially, the Golden Rule. In other words, places like India and China had this concept well before Jesus was around and they are hardly small regions. Secondary edit: It's interesting precisely how much some people tend to discount from their ideal Bible sometimes. So far we have by and large the majority if not the entirety of the OT, and then Revelations, discounted from BL's ideal Bible.
Yes, I have said it before.... It is so easy to say that god created the world instead of finding out where we really came from. Instead of finding a cure for aids i should just say that it is a disease brought down by god and its uncurable.... the answer to all questions is god lol... In my opinion, religion has brought us more problems than answers...first all the deaths that were actually caused by relgion ( the crusades, and other holy wars...) and thats about it....lol One more thing to say....Immortalrin you cant go to a debate and say that it is pointless to argue....to me its just wrong. Would you tell a soccer team to play a game without touching a ball with thier feet? I doubt it. Dont get offended....im just saying that you come here to debate not stop it.
I would. Just to see what they'd do. But only a little league recreational soccer team. Just so when they try to do it and they start to cry I can laugh. Mwuaha. I'm sadistic like that.
Do you realize that the Bible was written by fallible humans, was translated and transcripted through many languages, then altered by kings for their own purposes? I know the gross and bad parts of the Bible too. Brothers rape sisters, cities wiped out for angering God, and one of the things I find particuallry gross is the circumcising of dead soldiers. I do believe I previously stated that my church does not rely only on the Bible, and when we do rely on it it is through metaphysical interpretations. Many religions share the same concept's as you pointed out, but unfortunately not many realize this. We also follow teachings of Buddah and Hindi teachers with a variety of others. I'm not in anyway denying the value of the information found in other religions, just saying that Christianity has its good points too along with the really bad. Winners write history, and the Christians won some. When countries are conquered the new rulers set up their beliefs, and in addition to that adopt the successful aspects of the conquered's culture. I am well aware of the cultures and religions destroyed by the Church. I'm not happy about it either. Millions of lives have been lost or ruined in the name of God. The Crusades, the Iquisitions, and thousands of massacres all came as a result of fanatical Christians. Not all of the Christian faith should be blamed for past members' cruelty, and many branches of it have suffered at the hand of those sharing a slightly different version of their own faith.
I'm not blaming you for it; I am however pointing out that most if not all of the good parts of the Bible are found in other religions often predating both the NT and the OT.
Yes, I agree with you, because where do you think they got the good parts from for in the OT and NT. :anime:
I myself do believe in God, But I think people have the opportunity to choose. There are bad things, and there are good things, as BotticelliLover already said, But I wish to concentrate on the good things.
It's not that Botticelli wants to ignore the bad things, it's that he doesn't believe that was God at all.
Eh. I have to say I do not believe in God. Nor do I at the moment believe there is any god or goddess. I just haven't decieded yet. If there ever was God, then bloody hells, ya sure fooled me.
I know, without any hesitation, that God exists. I can see why some might view God as a mass-murdering psychopath, but I strongly disagree with this belief. Because my religion has the advantage of having more than one scripture to witness of God, I know that God's "work and glory" is "to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man." However this is a two-way commitment. If we fail to our part, which is to do the best we can with the information we are given, we will not receive His blessings and we will not be exalted. He will not send us to hell, however, if we fail to reach this objective, nor will we wipe us out of existence. I believe there are different levels of exaltation based on our own worthiness.
No you don't know 100%. Nobody ever fully knows something. You disagree with the belief that God, as portrayed in the literally interpreted Old Testament (I swear Im bloody sick of repeating myself), is a mass murdering psychopath? When all the evidence supports such a conclusion? ...Soooooo because you have more than one appeal to authority you're right? Given the massive amount of different religions, is this entirely fair? If I give you 30 different encyclopedias and tell you to write an essay, and you're exposed to every single one of those encyclopedias in some way shape or form, would it be fair of me to grade you poorly when I know you have numerous conflicting resources, each appearing to be accurate?
No you don't. Unless you've spoken to him yourself (or even seen him); it's impossible to truly recognize his existence. So because more then one person has reported Bigfoot sightings then Bigfoot automatically exists and is currently on a rampage of destruction? I hate to repeat myself, but unless YOU yourself have spoken to God and asked him about this, there's no way to KNOW what is work and glory is, or to even know that he exists. Has he verified all this for you? Did he sign it? Can I see it? Where's the proof? Some book written centuries ago (which, by the way, is also considered a faulty source of information by some people)? What would you say to me if I made a post saying "I KNOW there is no God, because almost nobody's seen him"? The fact that he doesn't often show himself certainly doesn't deny his existence, but it doesn't really support it either. You're arguing that because a few people saw something, it is so. How do you know that these people weren't just imagining things? If we're talking miracles here; there's a little something called coincidence. Now I honestly don't believe in God, but I'm certainly not going to sit here and say that all my beliefs are right just because I say so. There's certainly a possibility of a God, but everybody has their own personal beliefs, and if you want us to even consider converting to yours (not that I would) then you need to give some better proof. I apologize if this post came off as rather snippy, but I honestly don't know what other way to say it.
In the great words of Alan Rickman in his portrayal of the Metatron: "Whenever some person proclaims they're talking to God, really, they're talking to me... or they're... y'know... talking to themselves." And the comment about the scriptures.. makes it sound like the church has countless numbers of different scriptures with slightly altered content just in case one story gets old. I can see it all now... one faithful Sunday after mass... Altar Boy: Priestman, something terrible is happening! People are losing faith everywhere, they just can't trust these stories! Priestman: Holy Jumping Jesus H. Christ On A Pogo-Stick, Altar Boy! But I have an idea! Altar Boy: But Priestman, you don't mean --! Priestman: Yes I do, Altar Boy! We must unlock the safe to.. Scripture Version 7.2! Hurry! To the Priest Cave! (cue old-time Batman theme song) Sad thing about me is I actually pictured that out while I typed it.
Now I shall relate a story. It is called "Myer the Tyer", that I read from some magazine at some point. Anywho, Myer was a Jewish fly tyer, and of course, as a fly tyer he enjoyed fly fishing. So every week he would go fly fishing with some of his friends. Now those who have fly fished, or have just witnessed it, know that fly fishing is practically an art form, and while our good Myer was an excellet tyer, he was frankly a lousy fly fisherman. His friends have remained silent about this fact for some time, since they know how sensitive he is about his fly fishing, but eventually it was inevitable that they ask. "Myer, we know you love fly fishing and all, but in all the times we have fished together never once have you succeeded in catching a fish. You're lucky to even hit the water, why do you persist?" "It's not my fault, it's God," Myer said immediately. "God? Why blame God, if anything it would seem your bad luck with fly fishing would discourage you from even believing in God." "Here, let me show you something," Myer said, and he starts to lead them away from the river they happened to be fishing at that day to dry ground. Once there Myer demonstrated masterful skill with his fly rod. Dumbfounded his friends just had to ask, "Myer, that was amazing, but that seems to be proof enough that there isn't a God if you can do that here, but not when it matters." "No," Myer said, "it's definitive proof that God does exist, because it's too ****ed up to be a coinsidence!"
Scientifically nobody can ever fully knows something. However, who can measure how much a mother loves her child? Feelings like love can never be proven, and I think this belief in God is similar to those feelings. I have prayed to receive confirmation that God exists and I have been given this knowledge. I can't deny it to myself or him, no matter what others may think. I apologize for having you repeat yourself, it's just God has also shown his enormous love for his children. He was was truly a mass murdering psychopath, he would allow us all to burn in hell for eternity. Instead, he gave us our Savior to atone for our sins so that if we repeat we can be exalted. As BotticelliLover said "the Bible was written by fallible humans, was translated and transcripted through many languages, then altered by kings for their own purposes." The other scriptures my religion uses are unaltered by the kings. My religion believes that the scriptures we use were translated by God through a worthy prophet and therefore contain the full, unaltered gospel. As I said, we will be held accountable for what we do with the knowledge we have been given. Someone born in conditions were they have no chance of receiving the gospel will not be condemmed for this. They will be judged by the works they do, whether good or evil. Simply because Mother Theresa, or anyone else, was not a member of my church, doesn't mean we believe she won't be able to be exalted. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. If you were to make this post, I would hold nothing against you. I am not trying to force my beliefs down everyones' throats, I am merely stating them. (I am also not trying to convert anyone.) I can't prove my religion is true any more than I can prove God's existance. As I have said, I have prayed about these things and I have a personal testimony about them. Don't worry about hurting my feelings. I really enjoy debating about my religion and learning about others' beliefs. :anime:
How do you know you weren't decieved by either a demon or your own mind speaking to you? Once again - dealing strictly with a literally interpreted Biblical God, that is NOT love for his children! The fact that he chose murder period is disturbing. If a mother kept having kids and killed four that were disobedient, and later on decided to try letting her kids repent, would that make her a good mother? Of course not. In the Old Testament, God commited countless atrocities. He murdered. He commited genocide. He ordered sexist, racist policies and endorsed murder and rape of civilians he happened not to like for one petty reason or another. He even nearly wiped out the entire population of the world. How anyone could love a LIBG (Literally Interpreted Biblical God) is beyond me. It's wonderful that you believe that, but if I believe I am Napolean that doesn't make it necessarily so. I'm guessing you're a mormon since you're showing Biblical reasonings (including mention of Jesus) and this talk of a worthy prophet who didn't let kings alter it reminds me of Mormonism. Ok, thats more reasonable. Good, theres nothing worse than crybabies.
Well said Neph. Sorry, KazigluBey. I don't think you understood what I meant about men's translations. Your scriptures were translated by a prophet you say, and that means he was a man. He can make mistakes as well as anyones else, and more likely so if there wasn't more than one opinion on the translations. Why must people dwell on Jesus's dying? What about the symbolism of his rebirth? Question your faith. It's the only way to truly understand it. [Edit] Oops! By rebirth I meant resurrection.
